How old is JiuJitsu? (1 viewing) (1) Guest
How old is JiuJitsu?
by StallionRGA 4 Months, 2 Weeks ago
Have you guys ever wondered how old is really JiuJitsu?

Before Carlos Gracie learned from Mitsuyo Maeda, before Jigoro Kano incorporated in Judo newaza techniques from the Fusen Ryo Jiujitsu school, where does this fighting art come from?

Some people say Jiujitsu comes all the way from India following the path of the Buddist monks from Southeast Asia up to the chinese mainland. Here is the proof that this might not be only a legend:

PHOTO

The photo was taken at the Bayon temple in Angkor Cambodia. It's not just wrestling, one of them actually has a Udegarami ( Kimura) lock on the other. ( note also the detail of the thumbs!)

Amazingly the bas relief is dated around the early 13th century.
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Re:How old is JiuJitsu?
by nikola 4 Months, 1 Week ago
The 3 different stories I heard about the origins of JJ, Kung Fu, etc etc are as follows:

1. There was a monk, a single monk who crossed some sort of threshold and created the ultimate martial art. He then traveled the world spreading this. I remember it being stated that this occurred in the 1500's, but I could be wrong.

2. That it was through immigration of the people from India. In this case I would wager that its based Kalarippayattu, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalarippayattu If you dig even deeper than that, its hinted that early/pre Kalarippayattu was influenced by Alexander the Great's army, which as Greeks would practice Pankration. Which would put the age in the 4th century BC.

3. That each region developed their own martial arts. The idea here is that we all have 2 arms and 2 legs(-amputees), and that even though there might be one great thinker/fighter per generation, every civilization has one. Then through wars and competitions they learned from each other. In this case people have been fighting each other and doing versions of JJ since we learned to communicate.
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Re:How old is JiuJitsu?
by gboutis 4 Months, 1 Week ago
Ciao alberto, guarda questo:
http://historical-pankration.com/act.cfm?archive=Groundfighting

Personally i find jiu jitsu a martial art that one would ultimately arrive at on his/her own effort. That is, given time and freedom to explore the possibilities, one will arrive at moves that are found jiu jitsu and or other types of self defense without being influenced from others. Perhaps it is no surprise that one finds similarities in india and greece. How many ancient civilizations used spears and swords to fight? Should we attribute the notion of throwing a spear to one civilization? We are all human beings after all with 2 legs and 2 arms and I think that ultimately if one had to learn to defend himself/herself jiu jitsu like moves would be arrived at.

The better question is why some ancient civilizations copied others but couldnt quite get the job done. I wonder why?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Acropolis_of_Athens_01361.JPG

e questo
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/5364/leaningpisatowerzl2.jpg
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Re:How old is JiuJitsu?
by Bellistri 4 Months, 1 Week ago
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Re:How old is JiuJitsu?
by StallionRGA 4 Months, 1 Week ago
gboutis wrote:
QUOTE:
Ciao alberto, guarda questo:

http://historical-pankration.com/act.cfm?archive=Groundfighting

Personally i find jiu jitsu a martial art that one would ultimately arrive at on his/her own effort. That is, given time and freedom to explore the possibilities, one will arrive at moves that are found jiu jitsu and or other types of self defense without being influenced from others. Perhaps it is no surprise that one finds similarities in india and greece. How many ancient civilizations used spears and swords to fight? Should we attribute the notion of throwing a spear to one civilization? We are all human beings after all with 2 legs and 2 arms and I think that ultimately if one had to learn to defend himself/herself jiu jitsu like moves would be arrived at.

The better question is why some ancient civilizations copied others but couldnt quite get the job done. I wonder why?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Acropolis_of_Athens_01361.JPG

e questo

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/5364/leaningpisatowerzl2.jpg


Greg, we had this conversation in the past, the Tower is leaning but still standing, but I can't say the same about the Parthenon!! and don't blame it on the Turks!

By the way the claim that Pankration was spread by Alexander's troops all through Asia Minor and India in the 4th century BC is well documented.
Some interesting similarities between our art and Hellenic martial art can be seen in the basic fighting stance:
Pankration Stance

Does this remind anyone of the first Vale Tudo fights?
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